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Conversations on Health Freedom with Guest Vera Sharav

By May 23, 2022June 10th, 2022No Comments

Leslie speaks with Vera Sharav, a holocaust survivor and human rights activist, on how current events parallel Nazi Germany.



You can read the conversation between Leslie and Vera below.

Leslie: Hi everyone, I am Leslie Manookian, Health Freedom Defense Fund, and it is my absolute pleasure and honor to have a woman who, to me and many others is a true hero. She is someone who has spent her life advocating on behalf of people who were not capable of doing so for themselves. But the thing that’s most miraculous to me is that she’s a Holocaust survivor, and yet she’s not a jaded, hardened individual. She is someone who has true compassion for those who are suffering at the hands of the system. And she has a voice for them, a very loud one. She’s been defending freedoms for many, many decades, and she is an outspoken opponent of anybody who tries to shove unwanted medical interventions down our throats.

She’s exposed so much wrongdoing over the decades. I can’t begin to even start to explain what all that she’s done. But I will say this, she is the founder of the Alliance for Human Research Protection and she has exposed so much wrongdoing over recent decades. She’s a true freedom fighter and most importantly, a fighter for the truth.

It is my great honor to welcome you today Vera, I’m so glad we finally got to do this. 

Vera: Thank you very much for inviting me. I just really wanted to talk to you and to your audience. We’re living really, we’re in a kind of a super highway headed for catastrophe, and this is probably if it goes through, it would be the greatest catastrophe in human history. So we really have to be very vigilant and aware of where this thing is headed. I just want to quote, interestingly enough, John Locke, 1689, and he said, no, man can be forced to be helpful in a free society, individuals must judge for themselves, what information they choose to heed and what they choose to ignore.

We could use that today, couldn’t we? 

Leslie: We sure could. It makes me think about all the things that we are ” allowed” to do in our society and culture like cigarette smoking and drinking alcohol and taking prescription drugs, all of which are very harmful to us. And yet we still do it right? Or consuming french fries cooked in trans fats. You can do it even though it’s not healthy. 

Vera: Yeah. When others choose what we should do, they’re never responsible. They’re never held accountable for the harm. So I always tell people, you know, make your own mistakes, because if you make mistakes, you’re going to learn from life. If others make them for you, they walk away as if nothing happened and you bear the consequences. 

Leslie: Yeah. Many families with vaccine-injured children know that all too well. So Vera I want to ask you a couple of questions to kind of get this conversation going. First of all, I’ve become in the last 20 years, convinced that bodily autonomy is even more sacred than freedom of speech.

And I think freedom of speech is as sacred almost as they come. How do you, if you have to look at the most fundamental and basic of human rights. How do you rank health freedom? Where do you rank bodily sovereignty, bodily autonomy, and the right to choose what we do and don’t put into our bodies?

Vera: Well, I guess I would have to go to the Nuremberg code for that one because the Nuremberg code grappled with what actually was done, it wasn’t theoretical. The 10 principles that they formulated, which are really foundational as far as medical research, ethics, laid down what is acceptable research with human beings and what you can’t do. You see none of the other ethical standards really forbid anything from being done. They’re very wishy-washy about it, and that’s why the medical establishment really would like to get rid of the Nuremberg code only like the 10 commandments. They can’t it’s written in stone. And so the beauty of it is that it actually faced what had been done. This wasn’t, as I said, theoretical, and they wanted to make sure that never again, would the medical establishment go beyond the permissible with human beings. And of course, the first principle was and is the voluntary informed consent of the individual is absolutely essential. Absolutely essential. There’s no ifs, buts, or maybes. And that’s something that the corporate and government medical establishment don’t want to abide by. Its inconvenient. And what I’ve learned in the other work that I’ve done over the decades is really that human beings, particularly vulnerable human beings, whether they’re disabled or prisoners, children are cheaper to do in research than animals. The animal rights movement is much stronger, even though there are certainly, there are abuses in animal research. However, those who do animal research have to provide an annual report and account for every animal that was used in research. There’s no such thing for humans. So that shows you right away the devaluation essentially of human beings in research that they don’t have to be held accountable to what happened to people.

Leslie: Wow. So is this one of the reasons that we have seen offshoring of so much research as well though? So, all these giant pharmaceutical companies are going to the developing world to do their research. 

Vera: Yeah, it’s been going on for 20 years, at least probably more, but yeah, that is the primary reason. It’s both cheaper and you have poor populations. They go to the poor countries. They don’t go to the wealthy countries so they can bribe them for a few bucks. And the government is, of course, bribed them and looked the other way. It’s a free for all.

You know, one of the people who is called the gardener, John le Carré he, after he finished the book, he said, actually, mine doesn’t come near to the reality. It’s much worse. So criminal… There are very strong incentives, financial incentives to do criminal research. That’s the reality.

Leslie: This brings me to, I don’t know, perhaps it’s off-topic, but I think it’s one of the most important questions, which is how did we get where we are here today? And is it… You know I used to believe that government would solve these problems. I believe today that government is the problem. And I just wonder what your thoughts are on that. You know, how did we get here? And what role does government play or can government play or should government play in these health decisions?

Vera: I don’t remember the name of the scientist who said it and he was absolutely right. And he was focused on emergencies. Because emergencies have a way of catapulting everything that’s wrong and then making it bigger and more wrong. And that is that the stupidest thing that you do in an emergency health situation is give things over to central government or central anything, but of course, it’s government because again, they’re far away from where things are happening. So how the hell do you expect them to actually solve the problems of the here and now that are being faced by, for example, frontline doctors. So what we’ve done in Covid is the exact opposite of what you should do in this kind of a situation.

At first, let’s say most people and doctors and hospitals didn’t know what hit them, they didn’t know how to deal with this. They didn’t know what it was. But they weren’t allowed… very quickly, they weren’t allowed to test out existing therapies that might help, which of course it turned out that they do. In fact, they were prohibited from using anything that’s available.

Because central had a different agenda and central government has never… we still are waiting to have real accountability. I hope it’ll happen in our lifetime because this is the biggest crime. This is the biggest medical crime ever. They have their sights on the entire global population and what they are after now through international institutions that they fund and establish and control like the World Health Organization now will become if they have it their way, it will become the government, the one government that will dictate what you do in an emergency. And what constitutes an emergency, the WHO came out and called this an emergency when it did not meet the standards of emergency, which was originally, and for many years, the number of deaths. They instead went with the number of cases, cases with a PCR test that is particularly known for its high false positives. So it’s a perfect way to, you know, to clock something and stay blind. Essentially, they’ve been working blindly and forcing doctors and hospitals to work blindly. It led to medical murder. 

Leslie: It brings me to something that I think is really interesting, and that is, you know, you survive the Holocaust and I read a quote from you that you said when you were young, where was everybody, why did nobody do anything? And that you now feel a sense of responsibility having survived. And I wonder on the one hand, why do you think nobody did anything until it was too late in the Holocaust? Whereas now what’s happening is many people are trying to do things you and I, and hundreds of doctors and scientists, thousands around the world, right? Are working on this. So we do have a difference here, but why did it happen back then? The way that it did, how is it different now, and why? I think we’re having a big impact, but I’d love to hear your assessment of the situation. 

Vera: Well, at the time in the 1930s and ’40s actually public was diluted and the Jewish people were diluted. They were diluted by Jewish leaders who you see… one of the problems is, and that’s why really still the majority of the world is still going along, it’s very difficult for people to really imagine evil people. They can’t it’s out of their experience out of their own feelings. So they can’t really, they can’t believe that there is such evil and the same thing happened then. Did Jewish community… for example, in Germany, there were five years during which Jews could have escaped from 1933 to 1938. And the Holocaust didn’t happen just like that overnight. It happened in sloped stages and those stages were in part to test the waters. What would the world say? And when the world didn’t say anything, the next step. And that’s how it happened. It happened slowly and it was really, and many of the prominent survivors, Elie Wiesel was an Auschwitz survivor and Nobel Laureate. He said the biggest sin was silence. Silence, and indifference people just… until it touched them, they were onlookers. And of course, everyone in Germany, knew people disappeared, right?

People disappeared. People, people’s belongings were suddenly, you know, a grab… grab for all that sort of thing and they didn’t know. So it’s willful ignorance, right? And you have the same thing now, really most of the good people, the educated people, they are continuing to listen to CNN and the New York times, MSNBC and they can’t imagine that, the other is riff-raff, that’s the way they’ve been conditioned.

And it is extremely upsetting to see that indeed the longer people sat in university benches, the more close-minded they are. Because they truly have got it ingrained in them, authority, you go by authority. And when you defer to authority, you really are handing over your life. You’re handing over your passport. You’re handing over everything for someone else to disown. The worst part, and to me it’s really a crime. And I hate to say this to people, but it’s how I feel. Parents who deliver their children for these shots are committing the worst crime ever. No human has ever done that, nor does any mammal ever give its pups over to the enemy.

It just doesn’t happen it can’t it’s against nature. 

Leslie: It is against nature, Vera it’s crazy. 

Vera: No, no, but this is very, it’s been very methodically inculcated in people to trust, with just obedient trust without thinking. And it is really… These psychological weapons as manipulation has been developed over very many decades, really… even before the Holocaust.

And Hitler used the same thing. He used fear and propaganda. That’s how he held the public, you know, totally in tight reign. And that’s the same thing today. It’s fear and propaganda. And when I see people in New York City who no longer have to wear masks and there they are still a majority, it’s unbelievable.

And it is really… they truly believe that they are doing the right thing, that they’re protecting themselves and protecting their neighbors. And they don’t want to hear the possibility even that they’ve been had. That they have been misled. I mean, it’ll happen eventually, but it is not what is happening. You mentioned before, and that’s really very different from what happened during the Holocaust, which is that while the medical establishment is doing exactly what the medical establishment did, that they’re totally in lockstep. There were thousands of conscientious doctors and scientists who have put their career on the line and are speaking out and doing the research that is helping us. Because we can only quote them. I don’t believe that we should be giving, scientific lectures to anybody because that won’t go. But we can tell them what the scientist is finding and send them to those sources. I think it’s important for us to keep the conversation on people’s level. I mean, we see, for example, the other thing that is… I believe that because the United States government officials have brought this on to the world, we own it. It behooves us. To get over it, to get it out, to cleared it. And that’s what the scientists who are working on all these different angles, trying to figure out what this technology actually does, because if anything, it’s creating more and more variance and the vaccinated are now far more at risk than the unvaccinated.

And yet there still, but still, nevertheless, it turns out that at least in the United States that at least 65% have not accepted the booster. So that shows already that’s it. They’ve kind of laid their line in the sand. And I don’t think that any of those who have not accepted any of the shots will do so. That’s it.

So this gives us quite a few million people, and I think that our main problem is how to get to those people for them to trust us. Because really one of the problems that I mentioned as far as education is really a class issue, you know, the working class and the educated. And because nevertheless, we are still educated, you know, we need to somehow get those, like the truckers and the plumbers and, the working class. Part of the reason that I guess really that I can attribute they’re trusting their own common sense because they haven’t been indoctrinated this says a lot because again, this has been happening for a very long time, the education system, which trust authority, and just regurgitate what the teacher says, and that’s how you’ll get an “A” that’s been going on for a long time. What’s needed is far more, less restrictive, kind of dogma Because then people blossom and kind of trust their own judgment.

I happen to have not in a, you know, it, wasn’t a, certainly not a plan where anything that I would recommend to anybody else, but still I had an Odyssey for 10 months as a little girl, six and a half, where I was, you know, a child in transit. And I had to trust my own judgment of people because I would always look for people, adults whom I could trust to take care of me because I knew I couldn’t take care of myself and I didn’t. I was an only child. And so I didn’t trust peers. I still have the children as bullies. You know, I was little, but I looked for adults and I found them it was one family, Romanian family, who took me into their home. I was sick, they nursed me back to health. I was with them for about three months it during Easter and I remember very well, they let me play with the Easter eggs, which are very different in, the east European, you know, in Western it’s sort of the fabroshe, a very light colors. These are not… these are like the embroidery, they are just red and black Xs. And that’s how the eggs are and I remember it very well.

The point is there are good people in all groups, all nationalities, religions, all that means nothing. Although it’s really all those labels, all those, they don’t, show any difference in, in what kind of human beings the whole class has because we all, each group has they’re are saints and they’re devils and it’s a devil’s we’ve got… no, because the devils are the ones that people don’t recognize. They’re the ones who at certain times in history sort of come to the surface and take over. And they’re the ones that we really need to watch out for and to smite, if that’s the right word, it’s really, yeah. It behooves us and they are the ones who have caused all this and who are in control so far and want to definitely stay in control.

Uh, it will take a upheaval. 

Leslie: Definitely. I totally agree. So many of the things that you said there, reinforce my own thinking a lot of this, you know, I’m Armenian. The first Genocide of the 20th century and it’s amazing to me, Hitler said who remembers the Armenians? No one cares. And it’s really interesting how short human beings’ memory is. It’s clearly, you know, the adage, obviously that, we repeat history if we don’t remember it. And that just happens. I mean, it’s not been very long, right? Since either of these things happen and yet here we are again. But the other thing that you mentioned, which I think is so critical is just this entire cultural impetus, cultivating deference to authority.

You see that in medical schools, why do doctors wear white lab coats so that you look up to them as an authority figure. And then if you look at the whole educational system, right, everybody’s striving to get to the top. Everybody wants to go to the most prestigious school. And once you’ve gone to one of those top institutions, then you have peers who went to those top institutions. And I think you’re much more likely to defer to them. You’re like, well, why would I ever criticize the system that benefited me? Right? I’ve gotten a position and I’ve earned a good living and I’ve done all these things. No, of course, these people are just like me, they’re trustworthy, they’re good people. And they can’t get into that place where they truly understand that evil exists. It’s a real issue. And it’s, I’ve had so many people in the last couple of years, call me up and say Leslie what’s really happening? Like they want to know, and then when I start telling them, why would anybody do that? Oh, come on. 

Vera: That’s exactly right. But you see all those good people don’t realize that they are little marionettes, they don’t make the decisions and neither do those professors. It’s a pyramid, it’s a pyramid. And the apex of the pyramid. We don’t really know. I mean, it’s been called different things, but we know some of the levels, but people like Fauci college, they’re not at the pinnacle. They’re all. What Stalin used to call useful idiots. They do what we want them to do. That’s how it works. So each one on this ladder, like the tower of Babel, essentially, they are really just kegs who know, helping those, the evil on top to get their way, but those don’t show their face, their name is never uttered, but they run things. It’s run by these… probably several clans. 

Leslie: Yep. I agree with you Vera. 

Vera: It’s international. And it’s been since… look, I’ll tell you for example, here’s an example, which for some reason, I only came to it a little bit recently, which is Cecil Rhodes. He’s revered in the UK. Oh my goodness. You know? Sure. An empire builder. Well, who was Cecil Rhodes? South Africa, yes, he was the governor. How did he get to be who he is? Well, you know, he stole like 140 miles of land from the locals and diamond mines. De Beers his own pipe. He left his vast, vast, vast fortune to, a Roth child to be the… what do you call it? The one who…

Leslie: Executor?

Vera: The executor. And so they established a secret society to the secret society of all the best people, right. And established the Rhodes scholarship at Oxford. And what is the Rhodes scholarship at Oxford meant to do? It’s aimed at American men the best of the best to be indoctrinated the British way, because really that class, that upper class of the British empire. And remember they still have the monarchy and that’s the very much part of it. They still have visions of bringing the colony, the big colony back to the motherland. That’s exactly what it’s for. And we’ve got presidents, cabinet members, all of whom have gone through that golden door. And now we have this other one, which is the modern, you know, the World Economic Forum leadership program. It’s exactly the same thing, except this is worldwide. They don’t look just at bringing America back, but rather everybody under their fold. So this explains, it validates what we have said that you know, a lot of heads of government are puppets and there it is, they were educated at the World Economic Forum and they do the bidding.

So that’s how, when came March 2020 everybody in lockstep, the restrictions were practically identical. Each one could have slight variations. I call it, a little change in the color scheme, but really it was the same. It was lockdown masks, isolation, and dictates as to what medicines doctors could prescribe. And so the first thing they did was reactivate what was a Nazi program, the T4, which is euthanasia, and the first victims with the Nazis were German, disabled, infants, and children under the age of 3. And then it moved to children of all ages and adult disability. So they despised the disabled as both worthless eaters and polluters of the gene pool, it’s very eugenics. 2020, all of Western European wealthy countries and United States, Canada, and Australia got rid of a whole tens of thousands of elderly. Sent them to nursing homes and forbade hospitals from treating them and doctors and they were essentially medically murdered.

Now there’s a push to expand abortion to infanticide. Okay. We’ve got New York was one of the first. I mean, New York has been in this, these decades, among the worst, as far as expanding the template to more and more murderous kind of policies using public health. One of the things that’s very parallel between the Nazis and now it’s the use of reliance on medicine to give the seal of legitimacy, the veneer of regionalism. So now there are eight states that have already, have bills in which they allow post-birth abortion. 

Leslie: Which can I just say post-birth abortion is an oxymoron of the highest order, right? It’s infanticide, it’s killing babies. And for people who don’t know all these states are passing laws that children that die in what they deem the perinatal state, which I think is from about 20 weeks of age onwards to 28 days after birth is acceptable, it will not be prosecuted. So this is what Vira speaking about. It’s literally killing babies after they’re born, or if they’re born through an abortion alive, keeping them… not denying them, any kind of treatment. 

Vera: All right. Now, if our society has gotten to that, I think people really, really, really need to understand that. So it’s a hop, skip, and a jump before the three-year-olds will be killed. I mean, once you pass that barrier and there has to be some barrier.

Leslie: Vera, I have to tell you something. Someone just emailed me the other day saying that, he knew of a family whose child with down syndrome had to go to the hospital with something and was given a drug that would kill the child. And I think it was like an adolescent child. And when that failed, the doctor gave more drugs to ensure that this child was murdered. And it is exactly what you’re saying. It is a very, very short leap from, I mean, it’s already happening. It’s not even a leap anymore right? This just happened from babies being murdered to older children who are, you know, have no societal use. Now I don’t believe that of course, I’m not saying I think that they have no societal use. I believe every human being is inherently valuable, but there are those who deem them that way. But this is all connected, but it’s also connected to this whole, take care of each other, do your part. It’s the whole brainwashing of society. And what I don’t understand is how have we come so far from utilitarian is evil. Utilitarianism is evil, right? For our viewers, utilitarianism is the idea that it’s okay to sacrifice one in service to the many. And that was one of the most important philosophical and ethical takeaways from the number of trials. That utilitarianism is just wrong. It’s wrong at its core. It is wrong by any measure because it’s never okay to hurt one person in order to save another. It’s one thing if one individual choose’s to sacrifice themselves to help someone else, but society can’t make those decisions. And so what I find so complicating and really… I’ve been really contemplating a lot is how we went from utilitarianism is evil to you have to do your part and if you don’t, you’re selfish and actually, it’s okay to murder babies. It’s just, it’s crazy. I don’t understand. And when I say, babies, I’m saying born babies, right? 

Vera: Look, utilitarianism never went away on the contrary. It just went a little underground. And we’re talking eugenics. That’s really the big picture. And eugenics since the late 19th century has only, evolved in ways that they simply, they hide behind a screen, but they are just as determined to be rid of those who they deem to be not valuable. And when you talk before placing a value on human beings, you have to ask, well, who has the right to do that? I mean, that’s sort of God’s realm, right? God is supposed to… you know what I mean? That you can’t argue with, but this is actually, you know, in some of the notes that I put together, they actually, these oligarchs who are doing all this, who have the reigns of control more or less. Or want to, first of all, they do absolutely like the Nazis believe in their own greatness. The Nazi’s regarded themselves as Übermensch -Superman.

And so do these guys. These also regard themselves as entitled to make the decisions and to give orders because they are superior and they now have even evolved the idea that now they humans, they still call themselves humans will be the new gods. They actually, what they’re doing and what they’ve been doing with society in a very, very calculated way is to get rid of… the same way that the Nazis did is to eliminate the whole idea of moral values of human values. That humans are no different from widgets, not even animals we’re talking by now transhumanism, which I really, I must say that until about six months ago, I would have come on that’s science fiction you can’t be serious. Oh yeah. They’re very serious. They’re very serious. And they have a plan, the great reset and it all that whole great research relies on having control over people’s lives through the ID. The Nazis also used technology. Technology is what enabled them to have, an industrial-level genocide.

And that was IBM’s contribution. The IBM punch card system was essentially the precursor to the digital ID databases. It was a database and it was only after IBM identified every Jew first in Germany and then in the occupied countries, only then did the rest of the machine really start to evolve. Because once they could identify them, they could track them. Then they could eliminate Jews from universities, from the civil service. They could then take away their assets, their property, remove them from their home, isolate them from the community. It just went on and this was all with the IBM identification. The IBM ran the trains to the death camps to ensure that they ran on schedule, coming with the load of people and going off empty, not a minute to spare. IBM tracked the prisoners at some of the concentration camps and IBM… the tattoos that people at Auschwitz had were IBM numbers and IBM also had the codes for cause of death, feeding, starvation, suicide, and gas. They had a code for everything. This is important for people to grasp, because of course now the technology and IBM is still among the leading in the pack. It’s just so much more powerful. And there’s Yuval Noah Harari historian, and he’s kind of the spokesman who explains all of this, all their plan, and how great it will be. Yeah, he says, having the ID under the skin means that you will be controlled 24 hours a day, seven days a week. No hiding anywhere. 

Leslie: Yeah. And Vera for our viewers who may not know, let me just say that after McCrone was, um, supposedly re-elected last week with huge irregularities, right? I mean, it was actually on the screen. They took votes away from his opponent and gave them to him over a period of about an hour. But within a day, I believe he announced that a digital vaccination card and very importantly, the World Health Organization, the following day, I think it was the following day, but it was right around there. They announced a contract with a Deutsche Telekom subsidiary to create a digital vaccine passport and digital identification linked to a QR code for every single human being on the planet.

This is not about public health. This is not about public health. This is about control pure and simple. And. If people can’t see that I don’t really know what to do. It’s really challenging. And I find, I think this is actually a really good segue into a question that I’ve really been wanting to ask you, which is how perplexing it is that the Israelis with the history that they have, have been some of, if not the most compliant people on the planet, how does Jewish history lead to that outcome? I find it very confusing. Is it that they suffer from a ongoing generational Stockholm syndrome? Is it a political thing? What is it, what are your views on that? How has it happened? 

Vera: Well, for one thing, nothing unusual, but still they’ve had a corrupt government for quite a while. It’s like on the one hand, I too was shocked and still am, but as I said earlier, you know, all groups are prone to human frailties. And one of the things that made the Israelis a little bit different is that they have had a health care system for more than 40 years that they trust. This is so…. here you see what a betrayal of trust, you know, what it does, what it’s capable of. In other words, they have had, and they were very proud, I remember I have a sister-in-law who told me she goes to a doctor she immediately gets the report on her cell phone, same time the doctor does. And I thought, gee, you know, they’re treating them like grownups, cause we would have to go through all kinds of… but you see this helped to inculcate this idea of trusting the medical. And more recently when I said something, she said, I trust the public health, that’s it? No, no more discussion. So that trust in the public health, it surpassed the fact that they didn’t trust Netanyahu for, you know, BB, they, they definitely, the country was divided in half and yet it didn’t occur to them that this criminal would, that you might have to check the contract with another criminal.

I mean, you know, you’ve got two criminals making a deal and the public is sort of suspended. That’s how bad it is when you suspend your requirement, your responsibility to make decisions for yourself. This is in other words, obedience became a weapon. Whereas you used to… the way in which it was inculcated is trust, trust the authority, therefore obey, they know better. They know more than you. And when you just accept that blindly, you are really ready to be victimized, you’re ready to be a Patsy. I mean, used to be can sell them a Brooklyn bridge, now they’re selling them boosters. People when they suspend… somehow when they trust it’s a terrible thing because that trust to authority actually removed trust among family members, family members have broken ties over this Covid. 

Leslie: Yeah, to me what’s really happening is the destruction of Western civilization in a controlled and deliberate way. And I mean, it’s deliberate, because of the failure of their leadership over so many decades, they can’t kick the debt, can down the street any further. And so they’re in a position. They meaning the people who are in charge of Western civilization are basically stuffed. They’ve painted themselves into a corner. And one of the reasons I believe they were euthanizing, the aged was because of the fact that they are “a drain” on society, right? And that they had to do something. And so this is what the whole point of the great reset is. What’s really interesting to me is that comment that Dr. Meryl Nass put out about 65% of Americans refusing the booster. I think that’s really, really interesting. And then I also heard a story about a professor who was teaching a bunch of grad students. So, you know, postgraduates and he asked his class, how many of you trust public health agencies raise your hand and the entire class erupted in laughter you wrote it in laughter. And that is really encouraging to me because I think, so many people who are in colleges are …that’s where they’re indoctrinating the droves of young people. And so I took that as a real comfort. But it’s crazy. And I think that the other piece of it, which I really wonder about is. The founding fathers of the United States were truly some of the greatest geniuses who ever lived because the fact that we have 50 states with 50, 50 separate governors and state legislatures has been a true bulwark against the onslaught that is being pushed on all of these and experienced in all these other countries.

And I look at Israel, a small country. I don’t know how many newspapers there are, but I think that most of the newspapers are national, right. Whereas here we’ve got all these independent, there’s just, it’s a huge population with lots of independent media, and so that helps. And I wonder if that plays a role as well, that there’s maybe one more monolithic media enterprise, but also if there’s only one it’s easier to control and it’s no secret that Bill Gates gave a billion dollars to the media around the world in the first 10 years of this century. And he said it was so that they would report things the way that he wanted them to right? He trained them he gave it, right? My point is that the media has been captured in the same way that the hospitals and the universities and the journals and everybody had been captured. But I wonder if the media together with the money and also its shape in Israel has played a role in your mind.

Vera: There’s more than that. The language, most Israelis read and listen to Hebrew media. They speak English, but it’s a little bit of the way I speak Hebrew, but my reading and all that is not so great. So that too creates kind of a ghetto, even though you know Israelis are all over the world and all that, but the other thing, there’s another thing. You know it’s just like at a certain point in history for quite a while, Jews were kind of forced into being the bankers, the money changers because they weren’t allowed in other professions and Christianity at the time that totally looked askance at moneylenders, but they needed them, the governments needed them, so Jews were doing that. So that was part of what, in many European countries, Jews became the despised ones because they were the ones who came, pay your debt. Now it was technology, the brightest, and a lot of them went into technology. So they are totally immersed in that mindset of technology, not the humanities.

So history is altogether in Western culture, history has taken and all the humanities have taken a complete backseat. Part of it is the universities themselves have a lot to do with it too. The pay scale for professors in medicine, law, technology, and business. Those four have no relationship to the pay scale of philosophy or history, language. It’s a different world. So the incentive is all to go into technology. Think about all the technocrats and all that. They really, they are a different breed. They think differently. They don’t think about ethics. They think about if I’ve got a hammer, I’ve got to use it and perfect it.

They don’t think about some things shouldn’t be done. So let’s go back to Nuremberg. Nuremberg has in it thou shalt not, just like the 10 commandments. That’s why I like it so much. And it’s 10. They, in fact, according to the Nuremberg code, if you have reason to believe that an experiment will be hazardous and doesn’t really have a therapeutic offering the only way you can do it is if the doctors themselves are the subject.

Leslie: That would resolve a lot of problems wouldn’t it? Give these jabs to all the doctors first. 

Vera: Right doctors first. But you know, what is interesting because I had dealt a great deal with ethicists during a few decades and the first thing they did was make it, oh, it’s unethical for doctors to… And I realized, well, of course, it’s unethical. You see, they protect themselves from having to deal with the same things that they impose on others. But the mindset of technocracy and the tech people is really a very, very, tunnel vision kind of thing. And, in other words, ramifications that are negative, they dismiss that, that doesn’t matter.

Leslie: Vera. I kind of think it’s a spiritual issue as well, because you know, if you pay any attention to quantum physics, you’ll understand that they can split a photon drive them and five miles apart stimulate one and the other one will react exactly at the same time. There’s no delay. What does that tell us about life? Well, certainly it tells us that human life and just life is so much more complex then we understand, but it also tells us there’s some kind of web, some kind of energetic, something that connects us all right? And the reason I think it’s so important to actually even mention this is because these technocrats view us as nothing more than a bag of bones. We are these mechanistic, materialistic things, rather than what I believe, which is that we are spiritual beings having a physical experience. 

Vera: Right, but you see, they’ve gone now a step further, which Harari talks about is… I’ll quote something… humans will now become the gods.

They don’t want to only eliminate God, but the concept of God. 

Leslie: But I think also if you can eliminate the concept of God, if you think that human beings are only a bag of bones, then it’s okay to tag them, trace them, enhance them, implant things in their brains, and also kill them. Dispose of them, treat them like cattle, like animals, because you don’t actually see any difference between a human being and all the other animals that… so, you know, in essence, it’s this spiritual dichotomy between those of us who believe that there’s some meaning to life and something bigger than us out there that actually animates all of life, right? Not just human existence, but all of life. Those who believe that we’re just, you know, it’s random. There’s nothing more, you die. You’re a bag of bones, we’ll just take your heart out and put a new one in. Not to say that if I had a heart issue and I needed one, I might not do it. But we do know that people have experiences related to the heart that’s been transplanted into them, right? There’s something going on. There’s something bigger than us as an individual.

Vera: They don’t want to admit that because they want to control it. You see, it’s all about control. And so one of their objectives though, you’ll see is while they would use our parts and do all kinds of tests on us, they want the secret of long life for themselves. They want to live for you know, 200 years. Absolutely. That’s part of their objective.

Leslie: It’s interesting.

Vera: It’s totally evil. No, no, this is totally egocentric. The hubris is unbelievable. And since they don’t have any human empathy, human feelings toward anything really it’s… they’re without emotion. They’re like total blanks. So therefore they can’t relate to other people. 

Leslie: And this is why other people can’t even comprehend behaving like that right? It’s so contradictory to everything that most decent people feel and how they live their lives and how they orient themselves in life, right? That they can’t even imagine it. But it reminds me of, do you know who Bridgette Gabriel it is? She’s a Lebanese American, and she does this unbelievable presentation and this Muslim woman asks her, why aren’t you talking about, Muslims or something and about how good most Muslims are?

And Bridgette says, I’m so glad you asked the question, and then she gives this like eight-minute lecture all about how the good, innocent, decent majority doesn’t commit the crimes. It is the minority, the dangerous, evil, heartless minority that commits all of the crimes. 

Vera: Well, that’s what we were talking about. Each group has that and unless we contain them, they will wreak havoc on everybody else without exception. I mean, they really are prepared to go all the way. And right now, I thought that the nuclear option was off the table because how can they protect themselves? I mean, nuclear goes all over. So I don’t really quite understand this game, it’s like as kids, you play a certain game, you know, you’re getting the hotter closer, closer, closer, you know, until wherever it’s hidden. And so they’re playing with nuclear now. With that, I don’t see… they don’t have where to hide either. I mean, you know, we know from Chernobyl that for years and years, Europe was full of it and cancer rates were astronomical. 

Leslie: It’s interesting though, you know, they have, I don’t know if you’ve heard about this, but they have, created Monsanto, Archer-Daniels-Midland, Syngenta, Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, Rockefeller Foundation, all of these elitists, they’ve created a massive seed bank. I spoke about this 20 years ago. They created this massive seed bank of about 3 million organic heirloom seeds from all over the world. 

Vera: For themselves. 

Leslie: Yes, and these are the GMO manufacturers’ people, okay. That’s who Monsanto Archer-Daniels-Midland and Syngenta are. And they put them all into this massive compound on a rock off the Northern coast of Norway across the Arctic Circle. And with 10-foot thick walls, concrete walls. I mean, it’s this massive edifice. And then of course there are, I believe it’s been confirmed that there are underground tunnels in lots of places.

Vera: And there’ve always been. There’ve been tunnels. People use tunnels as well as ways of hiding and getting around, but still, the air is the air. And unless they ignite the stuff, you know, but this has a way of not being really controllable the way they think.

Leslie: Yes, I agree.

Vera: They think they can control. It’s not true. A lot of things happen. Then somebody, for whatever reason, either he messes up or on purpose, something happens and it wasn’t planned. 

Leslie: Yeah, I think the two keywords here are hubris and evil, but yeah, we’re near the end and I’d really like to ask you one final question, which is we’re living through very concerning times, very dark times when you wake up and realize that the people who are in control are actually truly evil and malevolent. That’s pretty uncomfortable for most people. We are up against a very big opponent. And I just wonder what, you know, sage words of advice you would have to people about what they can do. How can the average person make a difference? What are some practical ways or, what do you advocate for engagement of average people so that they can make a difference in order to right this ship?

Vera: Well, right away, the people who are listening to this are already connected and connection is really very important, both for your mental health, because you can’t do this alone, the worst thing. And in fact, when they had the lockdowns in isolation, that was one of the worst things. Most, especially the elderly who were trapped, it’s extremely cruel. And if you know anything, the worst punishment for prisoners is isolation. People were made that way, that we need each other. And so people, and I feel very strongly that people need to connect, make new friends. I mean, I have more friends now than before for sure. There are many people one needs to reach out to. I think that look, we are the many, no matter how powerful and whatever, they’re a very, very minuscule number.

And with all their hubris, that only is their Achilles heel really. They believe they can’t do wrong. They can’t make the mistake. Well, we’ll see, I don’t think that’s… it’s not the end of the story, but I think it’s so important to reach out, and this has to be really with groups. It’s hard for individuals I understand that. But to reach out to those who are already skeptical or altogether say, oh, this is all nonsense. They are, you know, we’ve got quite a few million people in the United States who could, if they rise up, stop the whole thing. I don’t think the human species are going to go down just like that, but it does take everyone to really stand up to their requirement at this point in history. 

Leslie: Well, Vera, I want to thank you so much for taking the time to be with me today and with our followers. And just to talk about some of the most important issues that we’re facing today in the world. It’s not just in this country, it’s in the world, right? This is a global plague on humanity. And what you said that they are the few that is absolutely true. We are the many, and if we just stand up and stand together, we will defeat them. Whether it’s tomorrow or in a year or 10 years, I don’t know, but we will defeat them. Thank you so much. I really appreciate it.